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 Dbm vie ses derniers jours

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Takeda Shingen

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Date d'inscription : 03/06/2007

MessageSujet: Re: Dbm vie ses derniers jours   Mar 30 Oct 2007 - 22:10

il ya apparement une liste samourai dans le livret de règle
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Chewbacca
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MessageSujet: Re: Dbm vie ses derniers jours   Mar 30 Oct 2007 - 23:58

Ok merci pour l'info Wink
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CHAULET

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MessageSujet: Info et détail   Mer 31 Oct 2007 - 14:17

Bonjour à tous,

pour faire suite à la discussion sur Field of Glory, j'ai réussi à glaner des infos sur le net :

tout d'abord les livres peuvent être commandés en pré commande sur amazon, il suffit de mettre l'isbn dans le champ de recherche.

Voici les principales info prise sur le site slitherine

http://www.slitherine.com/games/field_of_glory
(****** copié collé du site en anglais et écrit par B. Scott !!!******)

Pour le soclage :
**************************************
BASE SIZES

Base widths are 40mm for 15mm [ 60mm for 25/28mm.]

Troop Type Figures per base Depth of base: 15mm [25/28mm]

Heavy foot 4 15mm [20mm]
Medium foot 3 or 4 20mm [30mm]
Light foot 2 20mm [30mm]
Mob (horde) 5-8 30mm [40mm]
Cavalry 3 30mm [40mm]
Light horse 2 30mm [40mm]
Camelry 3 30mm [40mm]
Knights 3 30mm [40mm]
Cataphracts 3 or 4 30mm [40mm]
Chariots 1 40mm [80mm]
Elephants 1 40mm [80mm]
Artillery 1 40mm [80mm]
Battle wagons 1 80mm [120mm]
Commander As required* 40mm [60mm] or less
Fortifications Models of the defences 15mm [20mm]

Supply camp This will be a selection of tents, wagons etc. It is a rectangle 120mm [180mm] by 80mm [160mm]. It can be fortified if allowed in the army list.
*****************************************
ensuite Bradley Scott lache deux listes d'armées les hongrois et les ottomans
*****************************************
Hungarians

C-in-C TC - - - - - - CinC
1 SG TC - - - - - - - 3
1 Hungarian light horse archers LH Average Undrilled Unprotected Bow - - - 4 bases
2 Hungarian light horse archers LH Average Undrilled Unprotected Bow - - - 4 bases
3 Szeklers LH Superior Undrilled Unprotected Bow Light spear Swordsmen - 4 bases
4 Szeklers LH Superior Undrilled Unprotected Bow Light spear Swordsmen - 4 bases
5 Royal Banderium Kn Superior Drilled Heavily armoured - Lancers Swordsmen - 4 bases
6 Hungarian nobles Kn Superior Undrilled Heavily armoured - Lancers Swordsmen - 4 bases 7 Hungarian nobles Kn Superior Undrilled Heavily armoured - Lancers Swordsmen - 4 bases 8 Clipeati and armati HF Average Drilled Protected - Defensive Spearmen - 6 bases
9 Clipeati and armati HF Average Drilled Protected - Defensive Spearmen - 6 bases
10 Archers LF Average Undrilled Unprotected Bow - - - 8 bases
11 Crossbowmen LF Average Drilled Unprotected Crossbow - - - 6 bases
12 Handgunners LF Average Drilled Unprotected Firearm - - - 6 bases
13 Handgunners LF Average Drilled Unprotected Firearm - - - 6 bases

Ottoman Turks

C-in-C TC - - - - - - CinC
1 SG TC - - - - - - - 2
AG TC - - - - - - Ally general 1
1 Serbian nobles Kn Superior Undrilled Heavily armoured - Lancers Swordsmen - 4 bases
2 Qapu Khalki Cv Superior Drilled Armoured Bow - Swordsmen - 4 bases
3 Timariots Cv Average Undrilled Protected Bow - Swordsmen - 4 bases
4 Timariots Cv Average Undrilled Protected Bow - Swordsmen - 4 bases
5 Timariots Cv Average Undrilled Protected Bow - Swordsmen - 4 bases
6 Timariots Cv Average Undrilled Protected Bow - Swordsmen - 4 bases
7 Azabs LF Average Undrilled Unprotected Bow - - - 8 bases
8 Azabs LF Average Undrilled Unprotected Bow - - - 8 bases
9 Janissaries MF Superior Drilled Protected Bow - Swordsmen - 6 bases
10 Janissaries MF Superior Drilled Protected Bow - Swordsmen - 6 bases
11 Akinjis LH Average Undrilled Unprotected Bow - - - 4 bases
12 Akinjis LH Average Undrilled Unprotected Bow - - - 4 bases
13 Akinjis LH Average Undrilled Unprotected Bow - - - 4 bases
FF - - - - - - - Fortification 10
******************************************
Voila pour les troupes.

A+


Dernière édition par le Mer 31 Oct 2007 - 14:19, édité 1 fois
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CHAULET

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MessageSujet: suite des infos   Mer 31 Oct 2007 - 14:18

Dans un autre sujet du forum de slitherine, field of glory
on a une description du concept :
******************************************
10 KEY CONCEPTS in FOG

The purpose of this section is to introduce the 10 KEY CONCEPTs of FOG to you prior to reading the rules. These KEY CONCEPTS are the core of the game. This section will not lay out all the details but rather explain why each concept exists and what it is supposed to do. This, we hope, will make understanding the full rules much easier. The 10 key concepts are: 1.Battle Groups (BGs)
2.Battle Lines (BLs)
3.The Interbound Phase and Generals
4.The Complex Move Test (CMT)
5.The Impact / Shooting / Melee system
6.Points of Advantage (POAs)
7.Quality Re-rolls
8.Cohesion Tests (COH)
9.The Death Roll and Autobreaks
10.Shock Troops

1. BATTLE GROUPS (BGs) There is much talk in rules of units, elements etc. In real armies units came in many shapes and sizes – far more varied than anyone at senior general level would care about on the battlefield. Rather than get lost in such details we have approached these rules from the top down. We have pitched Field of Glory (FOG) at the highest generalship level on the battlefield. You are playing the role of the C-in-C and his top tier generals. You are not playing the role of people commanding small units on the battlefield. Every army has a senior command team. So what one needs is to define the "unit" size that is relevant to your senior level. - Your level is rather senior. We have therefore created the idea of the Battle Group (BG). This is our universal term for the level in the command structure just beneath the senior generals that you are physically representing and role-playing in FOG. A BG could be a phalanx block or a mass of tribesmen. These would be under a lower level commander and would represent a number of units in each case - but this lower level commander is anonymous in the game. In the case of the tribal mass it would probably represent a sizeable number of clans under the leadership of the most respected of their chieftains. In the case of a Phalanx BG it would represent one or several individual phalanx units bolted together under a single commander for the purposes of the battle to come. Looking at history most such battle groups would comprise either a single type or troops skilled and trained at working together very closely - e.g. troops with supporting archers. This is partly because it is tactically inefficient to mix troops up too much at this level. You can see the BG effect in many documents on historical battles. The battle of Granikos as documented by Arrian states (abridged back to elevant details): Commander of the left wing was Parmenion, the right had already been given to Pilotas who had the Companion cavalry (BG1), the archers (BG2) and the Agriane “spearmen” (BG3). Alexander himself went over to the right - to pick up the Companions in due course. Amyntas was with the “lancers” and attached to Pilotas (BG4). Guards battalion under Nicanor (BG5), Infantry battalions under Perdiccas, Amyntas (a different one), Coenus (BGs 6/7/8 ) . The Thessalians under Calas (BG9), Allied cavalry under Philip (BG10) , Thracians under Agathon (BG11), Infantry battalions of Craterus, Meleager and Philip (BG12/13/14). So in this battle we have 14 BGs under individually named sub-commanders. In FOG you would buy and organise these BGs under anonymous commanders (or by all means give them names if you can). There is then a Commander in Chief - Alexander - and 2 Sub-Generals in Parmenion and Pilotas. Thus we now have on the table a proper representation of the shape and organisation of Alexander’s army at Granikos - go have fun as Alexander. So in FOG the end result is that every army will have a structure that gives a good historical representation of how it fought on the battlefield, and what it looked like on the battlefield. This will focus you on your job of commanding your BGs through your senior generals.

2. Battle lines (BLs) A Battle Line is made up of a number of BGs deployed together as a single block, or created by joining BGs together during the game. The Battle Line key concept is there to reflect the effectiveness of generals in controlling troops if they were kept together in large groupings – the centre, a wing, a rear reserve etc. Organising your BGs into suitable battle lines and putting generals with them is an important part of FOG at the beginning. This is because the general can influence the whole Battle Line in the early moves. For example, BGs can only march a second move if they have a general with them or with the Battle Line they are part of. So if you put your army mainly in 3-4 Battle Lines you will tend to have more control. This is our way of reflecting, in a positive way, the fact that BGs didn’t operate independently unless they had to. In addition, being in a Battle Line has advantages during combat, as your troops will tend to get support from adjacent BGs.

3. THE INTERBOUND PHASE AND GENERALS We have aimed to give generals (you) a lot to do in FOG to make their role on the battlefield as significant as they were in real life. Generals in these rules have a large effect on the game and are encouraged to do realistic things. To do this we have created a phase between bounds - the INTERBOUND PHASE – that is designed specifically for generals to take action. So in this phase a general can get out of danger or attempt to rally troops who are suffering cohesion dips or move himself towards a place that is expecting trouble in a little while. An army with good generals who uses them well in the INTERBOUND PHASE will tend to have a lot of control and cohesion benefit from those generals. Think of it as your own personal phase in the battle.

4. THE COMPLEX MOVE TEST (CMT) We have avoided ever having a situation where troops are unable to do anything at all. All troops have a certain number of simple moves that they can make whatever their circumstances. It may be limited to turning to face the nearest threat but you never have a “sit still and ignore the raging gorilla” moment – such a situation seems to us most unrealistic. However, some troops are not good at executing complicated manoeuvres when under pressure. We represent this with a straight forward pass fail test for certain “complex” moves – pass and you can do it, fail and you are limited to your simple move options. This is how we represent the abilities of highly drilled troops over tribal masses. So, for instance, undrilled troops can change direction easily when a long way from enemy, but when up close they will sometimes fail to achieve a CMT pass and have difficulty reacting/adapting to circumstances. Generals and their positioning on table play a major role in the success of this, as does your organisation of your BGs into Battle Lines. On average, undrilled troops will fail many more CM tests than well-drilled Romans. Nevertheless the Romans will still fail some – they also were neither perfectly flexible nor under perfect control. This mechanism brings in that element of command & control chaos that every general had to deal with.

5. THE IMPACT / SHOOTING / MELEE SYSTEM One of the great difficulties in modelling the effect of troops is that some troops are powerful in the charge while others prefer the long drawn out slugging match of a melee. We have developed a three part combat system to better allow such troops differences to be dealt with, rather than inappropriately bundling characteristics under some general heading. So instead of the more common shooting & melee we have IMPACT, SHOOTING and MELEE. This is a very important concept in the rules - it allows us to model troop who were very good at impact but who struggled over an extended fight (e.g. Celts as described by Roman writers). We can also model those troops who were highly skilled in an on-going and broken up sword-fight (e.g. the individual Samurai swordsman).

6. POINTS OF ADVANTAGE (POAs) In FOG we decide if troops have parity, an advantage or a large advantage in a single step without any need for numerical combat factors. This is done through POINTS OF ADVANTAGE (POAs) that apply in certain circumstances. Your challenge is to try to get your troops into a position where they have at least one net POA and perhaps two net POAs in order to give you very high odds of winning combats. Winning combats is the key to success. Rules are often described as “equipment based” or “function based”. These rules are firmly “function based” - the mere possession of a weapon is not sufficient to get a POA in combat. For example, ghilman (ghulam) cavalry often had lances, however their tactical doctrine was based around mounted archery and they were happy to engage in close combat with swords or maces. The possession or otherwise of lances becomes an irrelevance in simulating their battlefield effect, so you will see later that they are not credited with a “Lancers” IMPACT phase POA. They do, however, have a Swordsmen POA in the MELEE phase. Much more of this is explained in the troop definition section.

7. QUALITY RE-ROLLS We have separated out troop QUALITY in these rules and in doing so we hope we have managed to achieve a good balance of the effects of quality, fighting style, armour and drill. Our concept of quality is not simply one of morale, but also of fighting skill. The key concept here is the use of simple re-rolls for quality variations. Troops are graded at one of four levels: Elite, Superior, Average or Poor. Simplistically, if POAs are equal, one needs to roll a 4 to get a hit. Elite troops can re-roll 1s and 2s and will get more hits. Superior troops can re-roll 1s. Poor troops have to re-roll 6s (so rolling 6s isn’t so good here). This gives an independent parameter for quality that is significant in a fight and at the same time is very easy to do. You will find that being Superior vs Average quality gives a significant edge in an equal POA combat, and substantially – but not fully - compensates for a single negative POA. This reflects both the superior fighting skills and morale of high quality troops. Quality affects the odds of winning a combat as well as the likelihood of troops faltering if things go wrong. So Early Roman Legionaries are more likely to actually win their combats than Late ones – rather than just having more staying power.

8. COHESION LEVELS Fundamentally this set of rules is about breaking your opponents’ will to continue, as battles are won by breaking the spirit of the opposing army. This therefore is your objective. We call this concept COHESION LEVEL, as it is more than just the mental state of the troops; it is their communal ability to remain strong as a cohesive body. In these rules BGs will gradually have their effectiveness reduced through 4 levels – STEADY, DISRUPTED, FRAGMENTED and BROKEN (of little further value in the battle unless rallied). This is a cohesion ladder that troops go down through failing COHESION TESTS and can recover through skilled use of generals. You force your opponents down this ladder primarily by shooting at them or beating them in close combat. As your troops deteriorate they get easier to beat, get harder to keep at their cohesion level, move less well and fight less well. You will see later that a DISRUPTED battle group fights at 2/3 effectiveness and a FRAGMENTED battle group fights at 1/2 effectiveness.

9. THE DEATH ROLL AND AUTOBREAKS Permanent attrition is dealt with by base removal from a BG. This represents partly casualties and partly battle fatigue. Base removal is decided by rolling a dice against the number of hits – the DEATH ROLL. You are much more likely to lose a base if you lost a close combat than if you received missile fire or won/drew a close combat. If a BG loses too many bases it will autobreak and rout and can never recover. Poor quality BGs rout quite easily this way, high quality ones are very difficult to break this way. Small BGs are quite vulnerable to this, large ones less so. In addition the shrinking BG rolls fewer and fewer dice in its combats. This key concept is designed to work well in conjunction with cohesion above. It also creates brittleness in certain powerful BGs, such as those comprising 2 bases of Elephants – deadly while going forward, not so good if they lose a base…..

10. SHOCK TROOPS The traditional stereotype of Gallic war bands as rash and hard to control and Romans as cool disciplined professionals has been thoroughly discredited by students of the original sources. In reality, the evidence shows that Gauls usually advanced steadily in close formation, while Romans on many occasions charged without orders. Similarly, medieval knights have a reputation for rash attacks, but this was, in fact, the exception rather than the rule. Yet even the disciplined brother knights of the Military Orders could, on occasion, be goaded by Saracen horse archers into a charge against orders
*********************************************
Voilà.
comme cela on peut se faire une idée et démarrer une bonne base de discussion.

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MessageSujet: Re: Dbm vie ses derniers jours   Mer 31 Oct 2007 - 22:47

Moi et l'anglois ça fait deux... Depuis Waterloo je ne veux plus le parler
alors Wink

Y a un outil pour traduire ce texte ?

Chewie
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MessageSujet: Re: Dbm vie ses derniers jours   Mar 6 Nov 2007 - 8:31

voici un aperçu des 6 premières pages mises en ligne du livre de règle de Field of Glory
vous pouvez voir que l'ilustration a la part belle

http://www.slitherine.com/games/field_of_glory

Sénéchal Kirk
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MessageSujet: Re: Dbm vie ses derniers jours   Mar 6 Nov 2007 - 14:07

C'est chiant, j'ai pas vu les chevaliers Teutoniques, il y a bien "Later
Crusader"... Mais je ne sais pas à quoi cela correspond...

On verra bien Cool
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MessageSujet: Re: Dbm vie ses derniers jours   Mar 6 Nov 2007 - 18:43

Comme dans les livrets d'armée DBM, Later Crusader correspond aux Croisés de 1128 à 1303. Du moins, peut-on le supposer.

Les chevaliers teutoniques prendont logiquement place dans le futur livre sur l'Europe de l'Est médièvale, aux côté des Polonais, Russes et autres réfractaires à leur brutal point de vue Wink

En tout cas FoG m'a l'air esthétiquement très réussi. On est à des lieux de l'austérité qui à toujours été de mise dans le milieu du jeu d'Histoire. C'est plutôt une bonne chose, même si le prix ne sera plus aussi "cheap".
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TEMÜR

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MessageSujet: Re: Dbm vie ses derniers jours   Mar 6 Nov 2007 - 21:38

En effet le bouquin FoG est magnifique!

Ca donne envie bounce

Dit Chewee,peut-etre que les Teutons sont dans le 3eme bouquin:

STORM of ARROWS / Later Medieval German ?
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MessageSujet: Re: Dbm vie ses derniers jours   Mar 6 Nov 2007 - 22:54

Ca se pourrait bien, tu as surement raison Temur Wink

Les news tomberont au fur à et mesure je pense... J'ai tout de même
hate d'en voir un en français Cool
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TEMÜR

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MessageSujet: Re: Dbm vie ses derniers jours   Mer 7 Nov 2007 - 12:55

Oh OUI!

En francais ce sera plus facile pour le choix d'une armée et la compréhention de sa conception!

En attendant est-ce que l'un d'entre vous peut me fournir les règles DBA et les 4 bouquins représantant les peuples des différentes pèriods?

DBA se joue avec moins de personnages! Cela peut etre un début!
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MessageSujet: Re: Dbm vie ses derniers jours   Mer 7 Nov 2007 - 13:09

Later Medieval German ne correspondra certainement pas aux chevaliers teutoniques, désolé.
Toujours en se référant aux livres d'armées DBM (dont l'auteur de FoG est un des deux concepteurs...), Médiéval german 1106-1519 couvre le Saint Empire Germanique. Les Chevaliers Teutonique y apparaîtront sans doute, mais en tant qu'alliés.
Les Teutoniques auront certainement une liste spécifique. Patience, patience.
Cependant, j'espère pour vous que je me trompe Wink

Les règles DBA sont téléchargeables sur le Net (prendre la version 2.2).
Pour les listes, nous attendons que le président achète le livre de règle. Elles sont toutes dedans. En attendant, je fais avec celles du site de DBA online.

Oui, DBA se joue avec 12 plaquettes. Ce qui est relativement aisé à peindre, peu coûteux et peut servir de point de départ pour une armée plus vaste à FoG.
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MessageSujet: Re: Dbm vie ses derniers jours   Mer 7 Nov 2007 - 19:00

Je voulais dire un version de DBA en Francais!
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MessageSujet: Re: Dbm vie ses derniers jours   Mer 7 Nov 2007 - 19:59

Les règles de DBA à télécharger sont en français Cool

Les listes d'armées quant à elles n'ont pas besoin d'être traduites. On les comprend telles quelles.

Donc pas de soucis l'ami !
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MessageSujet: Re: Dbm vie ses derniers jours   Mer 7 Nov 2007 - 21:20

Tu peux me donner le lien?
Je n'ai rien vu!
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